Unlocking the Secrets of Impactful Advisory Services
Jasen Stine: Welcome to Account
Trends everybody. I'm Jason
Stein with Intuit Accountants.
My co-host, david Bergstein, and
I are excited to be with you
every couple of weeks to share
the latest news, interesting
perspectives and hottest trends
in the tax accounting world.
We'll have special guests on the
show to help break these trends
down and give you food for
thought as you find new ways to
deliver for your clients. And,
most importantly, we plan on
having some fun while doing it.
Welcome, all right. Welcome back
to Account Trends everybody.
Jason Stein, your host is with
me, as always. Mr David
Bergstein, how are you, sir?
David Bergstein: I'm doing great
today. How are you doing? I'm
not too bad.
Jasen Stine: I just came off a
vacation, although I'm going to
be paying the price for that
this week with a packed set of
meetings. It's funny you can't
take time off, because then
everything just gets pushed
around your time off. So I'm
dealing with that. But it's nice
to have gotten some time to
disconnect and we actually took
the family to Great Wolf Lodge.
Have you ever heard of that?
David Bergstein: Great Wolf
Lodge. I've heard a lot about it
. They were about to open up in
2024 in Naples, florida, I think
the largest Great Wolf Lodge.
Oh yeah, you can get early bird
discount before it's open. And
Naples, florida, that's almost a
pickleball capital of the world
these days.
Jasen Stine: Oh is it.
David Bergstein: With the Moira
Riedeville. Down there they hold
some championships, so check it
out.
Jasen Stine: Yeah, I'm not being
paid to promote Great Wolf
Lodge here, but it's fresh on my
mind so I thought it was
interesting and you see the ads
for them all the time. I think
it kind of had a theme park feel
to it a little bit, but more
cozy, I think, and that's the
Lodge part. Right, that is the
point of all that. I love that
they did a pretty good job.
David Bergstein: Yeah, they're
really. I guess they're noted
for being an indoor largest
indoor water parks in the
country.
Jasen Stine: Yeah, the wave pool
. They had some pretty cool tube
rides too. My wife and I got on
one, but it was a little bit
scary.
David Bergstein: I'm going to
check it out in Naples, since it
was just written up. So,
they're behind on construction,
but 2024 will be there. There
you go Well.
Jasen Stine: This week's episode
. We had Jeannie Whitehouse on
the show. She brought some
really cool insights. As always,
she's still brilliant. What
stood out for you?
David Bergstein: Well, I like
her impactfuladvisorcom website
and we'll call it. I'll call it
a level five training. It's
really the best training I've
ever taken, three times on how
to do consulting, because it's
not just financial, it's
operational, it's customer
service and it teaches you what
questions to ask the clients. So
if you're an accountant that's
good with numbers and afraid to
talk, if you threw this course,
you'll know a couple of
questions to ask that'll help
you transition into advisory
services, because you ask the
question and all of a sudden the
client's responding. You'll
know where to go from taking a
course.
Jasen Stine: Right, right,
exactly. We spent a good amount
of time digging into those
questions and what to ask, what
answers to expect, and then what
do you do with that information
? So exciting stuff.
David Bergstein: It should be
great. The one thing I like, I
guess, is this is the one course
that I've walked away with a
playbook. What to do, Not just
go, try this. It's the step by
step.
Jasen Stine: Right. Well, with
that excited to share this
episode with our listeners and I
hope everybody enjoys. Today we
have Jeannie Whitehouse with us
. Jeannie is the founder of
Impactful Advisor and has had a
lifelong passion around advisory
, which is really apt, because
that's something we talk about a
lot on the show here. Jeannie,
tell us a little bit more about
yourself and what you do for the
profession.
Geni Whitehouse: I'm a CPA. I'm
based in Napa Valley, california
, and I work part of the time
with a CPA firm that focuses on
the wine industry. I know that's
shocking, since I'm right in
the middle of Napa Valley and my
role there is 100% advisory. I
work part-time and all that I do
is advisory service delivery
for clients. I also do a little
bit of marketing and educational
outreach and things like that,
but it's really all about
advisory, and I've been speaking
about advisory for a long time,
since early 2000, and
discovered some training
materials and then been trying
to get accountants to do things
that they didn't want to do for
a long time. It's exciting, and
David and I've been out on the
circuit at the same time over
the years with tools,
interactive dashboards and other
tools that accountants could
use to have different kinds of
conversations with clients, and
we're still trying to teach
people how to do that.
David Bergstein: I believe
Jeannie's got the best set of
tools. I've taken her course
three times twice live and twice
online, because when you walk
away, you walk away with
actually the tools to do the
advisory serving and it's
numbers and non-numbers. I think
you've done a great job
promoting that and keeping it
running.
Geni Whitehouse: Thank you. I
didn't create it, but I was an
early adopter back in the day,
as was David and it's
life-changing. The materials,
the tools and just the different
way of thinking is what it
takes, I think, to be successful
as an advisor.
Jasen Stine: What I love about
that is your practical approach
to all of this. Everybody who's
not doing this? The biggest
thing they say is I don't know
how, I don't know how to do this
, I don't know how to do that
part, I don't have the
confidence to get started, and
so that's that knowledge and
expertise that we're looking to
extract from here on the show
today, or at least a part of it.
Geni Whitehouse: It's fine.
Everybody keeps beating the drum
that we need to do it and
nobody knows. First of all, we
don't agree on the definition of
what advisory is, and then how
do we go about doing it? How am
I supposed to change who I am
after all these years of
learning how to do tax returns
in my case and suddenly become
this advisor when I'm talking
about things in the future and
things that I can't check or do
same as last year, or when I
expose myself to a question that
I don't know how to answer, and
so there's a lot of fear around
this, a lot of lacking and
confidence that we have as a
profession, and having a toolkit
to apply is what helps you get
over that.
Jasen Stine: Oh, you have hit
the nail on the head and I want
to actually want to hone in on
one thing you just said, which
is that that piece about like
becoming a new person. Say more
about that, because I think
you're dead on with that. That's
probably the biggest hurdle
that's in front of everybody's
face. That's not there yet is.
This is the way I've been doing
things forever, and now I've got
to be this totally different
person. Now is what you're
saying.
Geni Whitehouse: Well, much of
our training is a count, at
least for mine. I mean, I've
talked to young people and I
think we're still teaching
accountants how to follow the
set of rules that we've been
given and do the same kinds of
things over and over again,
focus on getting data from one
place to another in the proper
order, check and balance things
to each other. We're not trained
in what to say about it or what
it all means, and that's where
our clients need us to be, and
it's a real struggle for us to
think about it that way. And
again it goes back to this
interactive dashboard that I
discovered. So I left the
counting when I made partner in
taxing and almost the next day
quit and went in and said I
don't want to do this tax thing
anymore. And then I joined the
vision software and I did my
first speech and that's when I
realized that the communication
thing is where I could really do
the best work and it's what I
was wired to do and the count of
the struggle with that. So I
thought I need to start working
on this and then, when I started
speaking, I found this
dashboard and for me it was the
magic translator and it was also
insights I never had when I was
working on tax worker, even
reconciling a financial
statement or tying out balances.
It was what things I can change
to produce a different outcome,
which financial metrics drive
cash flow, for example, and
which things I need to look at.
And it gave me a way to explain
that concept to a client which I
had always struggled with, and
I know we all have anybody in
this space. To tell a client
that they made a profit when
they have nothing in the
checkbook is totally makes no
sense to most people and for me
I knew conceptually that what
the drivers were, but I could
never communicate it in a way
that they could connect with it
until I found these tools that
let me say, if I do this, slide,
this lever, slide this, look at
cash flow grow. And I saw the
response in an owner's eyes with
them and went, oh, now I get it
. Yay. So for me that tool was
Nirvana. I mean, it was like
this is how we change the
profession. And then David and I
can remember us being at
something show together and
talking about this and it was. I
can give you whatever
technology I can uncover, but if
you're uncomfortable in having
a conversation. You're never
going to do anything with it, or
you're going to and I the
people that looked at the
software that I had again they
have conversational tool kept
saying where's the report? I'm
going to just mail it out and
not have to talk to clients. So
I had to find a way to get them
to overcome that and that's
where I found the training and
it was created by Edie Osborne
at Mentor Plus. So I found Edie
and these tools and everybody
that had been through her
training immediately purchased
the software because they knew
how to have a dialogue and also
how to put themselves in a
position of asking different
questions.
David Bergstein: And that was
key for me when I took that
course and I think and I can say
it was I'm not there I think
AICPA and everybody else copied
the level five accounting with
different names, because that's
truly you walk through all those
steps from traditional
bookkeeping to really helping
them move forward on a
continuous basis. I think that
was a great stride and I think
more people are adopting that
now.
Geni Whitehouse: Well, you know,
Edie first released the course
through the AI CPA was called
performance views, and those are
the people that I found people
that were trained in it were on
the AI CPA website and I reached
out to those people and said,
how do you learn how to do this?
And they told me about Edie's
toolkit. So I mean, it's exactly
that and there are a lot of
people that have been doing
pieces of it. But the beauty of
this tool set is that it's been
vetted for so many years in a
live setting and she addressed
all the concerns accountants had
when they tried to make this
shift and created a new tool
every time something came up. So
I have the benefit of taking
all that accumulated knowledge
and we put it online. I helped
her move it online in 2018. And
then I got the rights to it
during COVID and it's again
stuff that I use all the time
with my own clients and I know
it works.
Jasen Stine: And I want to. I
want to get more into like, what
are the actual things that we
could like, some tidbits and
stuff that we could get. But
because we're talking about this
tool and this training, where
do, if listeners are curious to
learn more about that, where
would you, where would we send
them?
Geni Whitehouse: They go to the
impactful advisorcom. That's my
site and again, I launched it
during COVID and it's the online
training is available there.
It's a subscription. You pay for
it over three months I tried to
break the price down and you
can just go on and do it
yourself. It's got recorded
videos and over 100 tools that
you can download Backlist
PowerPoints that you can use to
present Word documents, how to
conduct meetings, all kinds of
stuff, so you don't have to go
figure out how to do these
things. And then a bunch of
questions. This is the. It's
really strange when you tell
people that what we give you is
a bunch of different questions
to ask. But that's how you open
the door to different
conversations and different
service delivery for clients and
we just don't know what to ask
sometime, or we don't have time
to think about asking a
different question because we're
busy doing the compliance work.
Jasen Stine: Right, right, and
it's just the way. That's the
way we've been wired, so we're
just just continuing to move
forward with how we've been
doing things. And what do they
say? If you always do what you
did, you always get what you got
. That's right. That's right,
it's exactly right. And so go,
go check that out folks. Really
good, robust training. So,
jeannie, help us with some of
the key things that people
struggle with. So one of them
that I hear a lot is and we've
talked about it already like
shifting the dialogue with
clients. So what are the kinds
of questions that you recommend
people ask and what are, what
are the kinds of answers that
you hear from clients to those
questions?
Geni Whitehouse: Here's the
first. To me, this is the
easiest, most basic question you
can ask a client and if you're
talking to an owner, the
question that is the most
revealing is where do you go to
see if your business is on track
? If we will add and I've told
tax people to do this, but I
don't have time to ask another
question, and that's okay when
do you go to see if your
business is on track and it is
not? I hate to tell you this,
jason, but it is not QuickBooks
for most owners. It is their
operational system that feeds
something into QuickBooks. They
need QuickBooks to be done
correctly, but they are not
monitoring by the minute what's
happening in their business in
QuickBooks. They're going
somewhere else. So what we need
to do is align with that, help
them get those insights quicker
and then help them simplify the
process of getting that data
into QuickBooks. There's a huge
opportunity for all of these
feeder operational systems for
us to get in there and help make
those better. If that's where
the owner is, that's where I
want to be and, yes, quickbooks
is huge we need that and they
need it to be right and we need
to keep all the numbers right.
But if they're over here and I'm
keep pointing them back to
something that's that's later
than what they want to know. I'm
not going to serve them, I'm
not going to help them improve
their business results, because
the pain is happening over there
somewhere else.
Jasen Stine: Yeah, that's
insightful.
Geni Whitehouse: It's really is,
and it's hard for us because
we're used to being in the
financial realm primarily and
there's all this other stuff,
like in our case in the wine
industry. The point of sale
system, which is what they also
use in tasting rooms and for
e-commerce, is a nightmare. So I
find out the owners are going
over there and running reports
and then the accounting doesn't
match because all sorts of
timing differences and things
that happen. So they have a
number they're relying on. It
doesn't match. So I need to find
out what's going on there and
get those systems to be more
accounting accurate so that we
can have system data flowing.
And then I've also helped them
build dashboards on top of those
systems so that it comes out in
a way that it makes more sense.
But also because of the unique
ability that we have as a
focused firm. All of our clients
are in the same industry and
the other really unique thing is
that they're all right here in
the small little community a 30
mile radius, I got all my
clients. I mean, I know people
don't have that luxury, but we
can now do the same thing with
virtual clients. But I know
they're all using a couple of
main inventory products and then
I can work with those vendors
to make those products better
serve my clients requirements.
There's a huge opportunities
around all of that stuff when we
start looking beyond just the
financial results that we're
trying to achieve. We can't
usually fix a financial
challenge in the general ledger.
We got to go somewhere else to
figure out the root cause of
that problem.
Jasen Stine: You got to go
upstream.
David Bergstein: And that's
what's really happened in the
QuickBooks community. Just to
give you the side of it, we
opened up the ecosystem and now
you have a QBO ecosystem with
dashboards that people make
specific to the industry that
they're in to do KPIs and
metrics around, whatever it is.
So everybody's doing what you
are saying. They're making the
financial system talk via an
ecosystem.
Geni Whitehouse: But many of
those tools are financial
statement driven. They're
pulling the financial data. One
of my challenges the operational
stuff. It's not a widely used
horizontal app, so there's not
stuff in the ecosystem. I had to
go outside of that to wear the
operational stuff and, again,
the inventory systems are very
unique, again for my specific
industry, but so I had to go
find something to get that data
in a way that was timely and
insightful for those owners.
Thank you. So and yeah, and
there's good sales data in quick
books that we're not pulling
into those dashboards either.
People like SIFT analytics are
sucking in GL data and sales
analysis. Now I'm getting closer
to financial and non-financial
data that I need to figure
things out. So, yeah, there's a
lot of progress and Girav is
pulling in other data, so you're
seeing this data from inside
QuickBooks being used to give us
a more broader perspective on
what's really happening.
David Bergstein: Well, and
that's the key, the broad
perspective that's out there. So
do you see a trend where and I
think we talked a little bit
about this offline where
accounting firms are going to
focus more on the consulting and
let audit and a test go
somewhere else because they're
seeing more of the opportunity
in consulting?
Geni Whitehouse: The question I
have is where does it go, david?
Where's going to end up? But I
think you know when you're an
auditor and I've only survived
the audit side of Deloitte where
I started for, I think, six
weeks and it was mutual
agreement that it wasn't where I
belong and I went back to tax.
But you know, when you're an
auditor, you do a heck of a lot
of analytics, you do a whole
bunch of stuff, but your
objective is to protect yourself
from litigation. So you have
all this insight that's going
into the working paper file
rather than stuff you're
exposing to the client saying
look at this, this is out of
whack, this is out and we might
if there's a fraud thing or if
there's some sort of trigger
like that, but we're not saying
and you know this, compared to
other people is not that good or
whatever. We have all this
performance metrics data that we
can use and we're not. So audit
people, I think, are in a great
position to do this if they can
stop worrying about
independence. Right, we got this
independence wall and then, if
we get in there and advise, we
got concerns. So yeah, if I want
to get into a client that I'm
currently doing an audit for and
deliver advisory. It makes
sense to spend the audit off
into another outfit and then
just focus on the advisory. The
advisory is stuff people will
pay for. This is what they need,
and to me that means advisory
means helping a client move the
needle forward in the direction
of their dreams, and if we
aren't doing that, it's not
advisory. It doesn't matter to
me. I mean, we can. You know,
tax planning is important
because it helps them have more
cash to apply to whatever
they're trying to achieve, but
it's not showing them how to
modify their business to achieve
a different outcome. So, jason,
you can imagine how many
accountants do you think are
calling up a client and saying
what's your dream? Right, I want
to visualize your future and
tell me. But you know? But in
order to help them go wherever
they're trying to go, we got to
know where that is right, and so
it's asking those kinds of
questions why are you doing this
? The Simon Sinek Y question
what are you trying to exit?
What are you trying to build to?
Are you trying to grow and go
public? Are you trying to sell
it? Are you trying to build a
legacy? Those are critical
questions, because then
everything I help them do after.
That needs to support that
objective. But if we don't ask,
we just jump in. So I come to
you, jason, and I say here I
need to follow a tax return and
then, if you're a typical tax
person, right, david, we just
get out the spreadsheet and
start looking at the financials
and making the tax adjustments.
Well, what I encourage people to
do is back up and go okay,
we'll help you with that. But
first I need to understand the
bigger picture of what you're
trying to build here, what's
working in your business, what's
not working and what it is
you're trying to achieve across
different aspects, different
areas of your organization, and
then I can really help you come
up with a long-term strategy
that helps you optimize the
taxes based on that but also
move you forward towards
whatever you're trying to
achieve.
David Bergstein: I agree 100%
with you. I ask all my clients
what do they want to be when
they grow up? What was their
purpose going into business? But
the key there is once you get
that, you do some tax planning,
you do some wealth planning. So
I agree with the advisory is all
over. And now you just added
another feather to your cap you
just became the president of ITA
, the Information Technology
Alliance, which I guess is what
the top 46 firms in the country.
Geni Whitehouse: We have
different categories of members.
So we have the top 50 IT. We
have the top CIOs in the top 50
CPA firms, so these are C-level
executives managing the
technology in a big firm. And
then we have CAS practices CAS
practice leaders, who are in the
top 100 CPA firms and that is
the newest area for us and huge
growth there and a lot of really
cool stuff going on with those
folks. Then we have consulting
resellers, who are partners
implementing mid-market
applications for clients, and we
have consultants to the
accounting profession and we
have vendor members, who are
either vendors that have a
partner channel of their own or
vendors who are providing
products to our membership. So
we bring all of those people
together and really try to share
knowledge and advance this all,
which is really the goal. The
more we share, the more we all
benefit. And it's a really
exciting thing for me because I
was a member back when I was at
Navision software. When I left
the CPA firm, I ended up at
Navision where I built their CPA
program and I joined the ITA
and it really connected me to
all the people who were driving
the tech space forward in the
accounting space and those are
people I've connected with all
over the course of my career
since then. So it was for me
really a huge jumpstart, for not
only me but also for our
company. We were an unknown
piece of software from Denmark
that nobody could even pronounce
, and it gave us credibility to
be hanging out with these other
major players, so it was a huge
thing. So it's really exciting
that I can come back and be part
of that. The technology space
continues to evolve rapidly, so
it brings everything I care
about together in one place, so
it's really fun.
David Bergstein: So is that, and
is ITA really promoting? You
know, they're promoting the
advisory of everything. That's
what it seems to me. No matter
what it is, it's all about
advisory.
Geni Whitehouse: Well, they're
promoting, you know, best
practices and growth and
personal development and really
meeting the needs of our clients
as those continue to evolve.
And so, particularly in the CAS
space, to me that's the best
opportunity to start advisory,
because the people in those CAS
chairs feel the pain that their
clients have every day. They're
close to the pain, whereas if
I'm doing a you know, once a
year something with the client
and doing financial statements,
I don't see all the angst that
goes on all year. I just see the
ending trial balance in many
cases. But it's the struggle it
takes to get to that point where
the advisory opportunities
happen. And so you see these CAS
teams actively seeking ways to
make life better for their
clients and also, hopefully,
getting comfortable with asking
different questions. So I've had
a lot of interest from the
bookkeeping community and I've
done a lot of stuff for Intuit
as well on advisory and training
, and I think I get the most
responses from those training
courses that I've done through
Intuit about you know what it
really looks like. So I know
there's a lot of hunger out
there and people are really
trying to figure out how to do
better work for their clients,
make more of a difference, and
that's really and yeah, 100%.
Jasen Stine: And you know, I
know you and I have worked
together on training, including
QuickBooks Connect and webinars
and all kinds of stuff, because
this is such an important topic
we just keep beating, like you
said it, I think, maybe before
you started recording you just
keep beating the drum, but
there's still like what is it
Right? So let's ground on that
for a minute, because I think it
was apt for you to bring that
up. What is it exactly that
people are, you know, struggling
to wrap their head around as it
relates to the definition of
what this is?
Geni Whitehouse: Well, on the
delivery on the deliverer side
as an account. That's what we're
struggling with is where do I
start? How do I start,
especially for an existing
client? I've trained them. One
of the problems we have as a
profession is we've trained our
clients to expect a low level of
service. Right, I'll call you
once a year and then I'll make
you give me a bunch of stuff and
then I'll sit on it for six
months and eventually give you a
result. That's much of what tax
people deliver in terms of a
client experience. So now I'm
going to go get trained and then
I'm going to come back and go.
Okay, now I'm wearing a
different hat and now I'm going
to be an advisor and ask you a
bunch of questions that I've
never asked you before. And so
people are going. They're going
to wonder why I didn't do this
before. It's not that big a deal
. All you say is I've just
gained some new insights and I'm
doing some things differently
and I just like to ask you a
couple of questions about your
business. What works? And we
have a format. We have this
basic little grid that we use.
That's the easiest way to start
a new conversation with a client
. The first. There's three rows.
The first row is what's working
in finance customers,
operations, people and end in
mind. So normally we just look
at the finance broken box, right
. We don't recognize what works,
and this is a huge benefit for
many of our clients because they
get some comfort oh yeah, I did
do something right. We never
asked that. Normally we never
think about it for ourselves. I
can give you 500 things I did
wrong. I can't remember anything
I did right in the last 400
years, right. So that's how our
clients feel. So when I start
them off, you tell me what you
did right, especially after
COVID. What did you do right?
What did you learn that you
could do well during COVID? What
did you learn now in post COVID
supposedly, although COVID
never seems to end and you know
with all the other stuff that we
have going on in our world. So,
financially, what went right?
What happened with the customers
that went that you're proud of?
A successful operationally,
what's working? What about your
people? And in mind, are you
doing things that are keeping
you on track to where you want
to end up? So that's the first,
that's the first set and that's
just asking that people go. Wow,
nobody's ever asked that before
. So, that's one point for me,
right? Okay, I'm doing something
different, I'm elevating myself
above all the competitors who
aren't doing this. So then the
second thing. Then we go into
the what's broken, what needs to
be improved financial customers
, operations, people in and in
mind again, and that's kind of a
SWAT analysis we're used to
doing. But here's where you
shift everything. The third row
of this little like it's like a
bingo card that you just use for
us to have a tool to keep
ourselves organized. The third
row is what is your ideal
outcome? Financial customers,
operations, people in and in
mind and we don't ask that on
the financial side. Normally we
assume it's profitability, or we
assume it's going to cash flow,
or we assume something. But
what do they want? And I've got
clients that don't want profit.
Necessarily. They have other
businesses and they're doing
this for some other reason, or
they're looking at long-term
growth in the value of the brand
and the land. So it's not a
short-term profitability focus.
I'm here for the long game. So
understanding what they're
trying to achieve ideally. And
then again, what are you trying
to do from a customer
perspective? Are you trying to
sell to everybody on the planet?
Are you just trying to capture
the state of California. Are you
trying to grow the markets in
these places? What are you
trying to establish on the
customer side? And then again
operations. What do you want to
see? Do you want to have a
clunky checkout process so when
you're buyer at the winery that
you've just made, your best
friend goes to buy the wine, it
takes an hour and a half to
process the credit card? I don't
think so.
David Bergstein: So,
operationally, what do you want?
And then, what kind of stock do
you?
Geni Whitehouse: need to meet
your objectives as a high-end
winery. So that whole framing of
it, that opens the door. Now
I've got evidence about where
they need to help, what they're
trying to do, what they're happy
about, and then we can start
saying which one of these is the
biggest pain point for you
right now. If you could fix any
one of these things, what thing
would you work on? Now I've got
okay, let's see if I can help
you. The door is now wide open
for advisory. This is why you
don't know what to do with that,
jason. If you ask all those
questions and then the client
says my top priority is to
improve the margins on my
products and you go. Well, I'm
going to have a clue. Sorry, bye
.
Jasen Stine: Which is not true,
right, yeah, right. And we've
talked about this like where
people think they have to be the
expert in their client's
business and then, to that end,
right, then you get all these
answers to these questions and
then you're like, okay, well,
what do I do? With this what if
I don't have a clue?
Geni Whitehouse: Well, that's
what you did. That's the mystery
that keeps us from asking those
questions, because I'm afraid I
need to know every, and I don't
know how to sell stuff, and I
don't know how to do marketing
campaigns, and I don't know how
to bundle products or do primos
or all that stuff that somebody
else is figuring out. But what I
can do is help the client get
data to understand which things
are the lowest margin. I can
help them analyze that and I can
build a model to show them what
levers they can push. And
that's when they get excited. So
what we would do is then
convene the leadership team and
try to get those people to come
up with ideas about what they
could do to impact margins, and
we can drill it down enough so
they understand how they
influence the margins on the
products that are sold, because
most of the time, the people
driving the results have no
connection to what they do. That
has an impact, and that's the
fun stuff. When you can get the
frontline workers in a place to
go, oh, now I get it. If I sell
one more bottle of wine to this
person, I can improve the
revenue by this much. Yeah, and
I can show you that. So that's
the kind of thing that we do
with these dashboards. These are
the three things you fix. Look
how much cash you generate from
that. And then we break it down
to the product level and to the
frontline worker level to really
make things happen.
Jasen Stine: And so what you
really become then is a catalyst
, not necessarily an expert.
Geni Whitehouse: We're a
facilitator and what I've had
the most successful consulting
engagement you can have is when
you summarize results of
information that you've gathered
and you present it to the owner
and they say well, you're not
telling me anything I didn't
already know. And I used to
think that was a fail, right
Cause I'm not giving them
anything new. Well, I failed,
but what I realized is how can I
possibly see something that
they don't already know? But
what they don't have is data to
support what they intuitively
know from their experience in
that business. So what I can do
is back it up with information.
I can gather data, I can
organize it in a way that they
can actually see it and then
they have a path to doing
something about it. So, rather
than running around with seat of
the pan sort of knowledge, I
can give them comfort in that
what they think they know is
actually accurate and that there
are things they can do to make
that change if they need to make
one.
Jasen Stine: Right, because I'm
packed that some more cause I'm
coming up with a reason in my
head, but how does the data get
you past the why? Already know
that. Say more about that.
Geni Whitehouse: Well, what I
said is you know, where do you?
Again, if I had started with the
question where do you go to see
if your business is on track
and they go, well, I wait three
weeks after the financial
statements are closed and then I
know and I go well, what do you
do right now? If you need to
know where you are and they say,
well, I don't have any info yet
, then I know we need to create
systems to give them top of mind
in the moment insight so they
can make better decisions. So I
mean it's a combination of the
whole dialogue that we have
around it. But if they say, you
know we don't have enough cash
or something, and I go, where do
you go to see that To the bank
right, jason, I go check that's
not exactly a good indicator.
What are you gonna do? So we
need to potentially look at cash
flow forecast so you can plan
ahead, cause once the bank is
there, you're only looking at
what's cleared and you haven't
accounted for all the bills that
have already been mailed out
and not cleared yet. So that's
the kind of stuff.
Jasen Stine: So when you find
out or the expenses that haven't
been yet.
Geni Whitehouse: Yeah, many of
them are, you know, smaller
businesses especially. You're
looking at the bank account, so
it's asking that sort of where
do you go and what matters to
you question. And then you know
if they've brought me in and I
mean, this is cases where they
brought me in to figure out how
to have an owner that wants to
retire and I can't get the team
to do what I want them to do.
Okay, that's a common issue. You
come in, you interview the team
, you start looking at stuff and
the owner is there for like
three hours a day and doesn't
really wanna be there and
doesn't wanna be bothered. He
wants to retire, but he's same
time has not empowered the team
to make any decisions. There's
no budget in place, there's all
this stuff. So you go through
this whole process and you say I
interviewed your team and these
are the things they said
there's not, they don't have the
authority to make decisions. So
they need you, but you're never
there, so things aren't
happening. So basically the
conclusion is you need to bring
in a GM, you need to bring in
somebody who's gonna manage
things full time so that you can
go off and do what you wanna do
. And he said Austin, you're not
telling me anything. I didn't
know, but he wouldn't act on it
because he didn't have data and
he also didn't have perspective
across the team. You know you're
gonna sit down and say what can
we do to make this better?
Nobody's gonna tell him to his
face well, we need you to be
here more, but they know that's
not what he wants to do. So that
kind of stuff. But it's a
regular occurrence because you
know owners really can feel it
that there's something going on
or that there's often can't
pinpoint exactly what the
problem is. But when you present
something like that and I was
really terrified, I mean this is
just one example, but you know
it's a scary thing to sit there
and say, okay, here's the answer
and the problem is you, they're
gonna fire me, put up some
quotes and I've had some stuff
and I had done the research and
interviewed the team and people
were telling me stuff and he
said you know that's when. He
said this isn't anything. I
didn't know. But he said you
know, this is hard to see, but I
understand, I need to make some
changes. And then I'm shortly
after that they brought in a GM,
so-.
David Bergstein: That's why they
call you the impactful advisor.
You are impactful and make
change. I remember from the
course one of the things I think
you probably show that really
makes a difference in everyone
understand. I think it was a dry
cleaning store. If they
increased the number of services
they sell and you had the
dashboard where you sell one
more thing for like three bucks,
all of a sudden the profit
margin went up and the cash
tremendously.
Geni Whitehouse: That's the, to
me, the most interesting part
about all of this that you know
most people are looking for the
BHAG the big, hairy, audacious
goal. They look for the big,
huge thing that they're gonna
unravel and fix, and what often
happens is it's the little thing
that you can change that will
have this big impact. And that's
when it's fun, when you can
break it down to the point, like
when I do these trainings with
teams and I say if everybody
just gets whoever's gonna buy so
somebody's on their way to the
cash register to buy some wine
if you can get that person to
buy one more bottle before they
leave the winery, here's the
impact that'll have on revenue.
You don't need any more visitors
to come in, you don't need any
more people to buy. Let's just
take the ones who are already
ready to buy and get them to buy
one more thing. What can we do
to make that happen? And I don't
know what to do and I know if
you get me drunk, I'll buy
another bottle, right. You can
go to the tasting room to drink
more alcohol, but they're
already doing that. But the
tasting room staff come up with
a hundred different ways to make
that happen. Now they're
empowered to see their ability
to drive a different outcome,
and so now they can think of
things and they share that with
each other and they get really
excited. So that's what we're
looking to do, but it's a small
change. I don't have to launch a
million dollar marketing
campaign. I don't have to do,
because I can drive as many
people as I want into a retail
site, but it doesn't matter if
they don't buy Right. And the
people in the sales seat when
whatever business it is, can't
influence how many come in. So
the only thing they can control
is the people in that building
and how many of those people
actually buy. And that's where
they see that they're empowered
now to drive an outcome that the
company is trying to get them
to achieve. That's perfect.
Jasen Stine: It's just really
fun. That's a perfect example of
the impact that this type of
work has and, to really like,
the way you described it
uniquely made me like, see it,
feel it. I can picture the staff
in the tasting room coming up
with these ideas, getting
excited.
Geni Whitehouse: They get really
excited.
Jasen Stine: Because they want
the business to succeed.
Geni Whitehouse: They wanna be.
Let's have this whole engagement
problem, and a big piece of
that is that we create KPIs, we
create measures, but they're
created at the top and then
imposed on the staff as
punishment most of the time. Or
you might get a reward if you
achieve it, but most of the time
we're saying this is what
you're supposed to do and you
didn't hit it. Versus, if I
bring in this team and show them
, if you can just move one more
bottle of wine to each person
who's already gonna buy, here's
what you can do, and we count
that they've created the measure
. And then Vega, this is cool
because I understand it and I
know where it's coming from, and
I'm going to see benefit and
impact on my commission if I
achieve this. So it becomes a
very engaging environment in
which to work. And you also have
to, though, jason. If I'm going
to count something, I can't
count it in the, in the back
room and not letting by no,
until the end of the month,
because then they can't change
behavior in the middle of the
month when they haven't hit the
targets they're aiming for. So
you've got to get visibility for
those staff, and that's hard
for some of us to do as well. So
not only empower them to figure
out what the count, but also
allow them to see how they're
doing, which you think is kind
of an obvious thing, but it's
not.
Jasen Stine: Well, why is that
hard?
Geni Whitehouse: Because we have
this sense of if we show people
too much stuff, they're going
to somehow take advantage of
that and try to get. Try to do
something I don't know like
provide discounts. If I show
them how much margin I'm making,
then my people selling will try
to offer discounts. Everybody
comes in. I've never seen that
happen. They want to hit their
sales targets, but generally
they want to hit their revenue
targets.
Jasen Stine: So discounting and
going to help I've heard that
with conversations of people
have about like the partner
model, right, like partners you
know who pull in just big
salaries you know several
hundred thousand dollars a year
salaries and their staff. You
know they don't share that with
their staff, which intuitively
you understand, like why would
somebody share their salary
information? But the staff are
like looking at the partners and
they're like I don't want that
life and they don't even realize
the earning potential there.
And so there's this disconnect
between advancing the success of
those you know that are earlier
in their careers and wanting to
get to that place. And so I see
it too just like with with
budgets, right, like with other
other earlier career folks that
into it, when, when they find
out about certain things and how
much that costs, they're like,
man, I'm in the wrong business,
I'm like, yeah, but you're not,
you're not thinking about this,
this, this, this, this, this,
you know, and that's what makes
up all that. And once they have
that perspective, then then they
can just approach it
realistically without that that
emotional shock to it, if you
will. And I think that's spot on
, like there's nothing wrong
with having a degree of
transparency in the business.
Geni Whitehouse: I mean that's.
I'm not saying that you need to
disclose the full financial
statements through cash position
, like that, but if I'm, if I'm
in a system where I'm generating
revenue and I can't see what
happened today or tomorrow or
the next day, then I can't see
that I'm not on the same level,
and so it needs to be visible
not only to the owner daily, but
also to the people that are
driving the results forward. So,
and one thing you're done. You
you're in there and you have a
register and there's a button
you can push to see how you're
doing. And we have a daily
target for revenue for every
single day, for every single
location in container store. And
we would come in in the morning
, we'd see the number on the
wall and then we go to the point
of sale system on the floor and
push the button and see how
we're doing. And at lunchtime,
if we weren't halfway there,
we'd have a huddle go. What can
we do to make this better? If
you've ever been to container
store, you just put some more
chotsky stuff around the
register, their little things.
And oh, do you need a paper clip
holder? You know, and I think I
was the one who drove it up
because I would buy every little
dumb thing that I saw at the
counter. But I mean, that's how
they, if you show them that they
think about things when
somebody asked for this
container, ask them if they also
have a closet hanger and I was
shoe filing thing or something,
and you could actually help them
come up with things that are
not just selling to them but are
actually helping them in
whatever challenge they came
into that environment to say to
serve to solve. So say well,
said Easy for me to say.
Jasen Stine: But well said
overall.
David Bergstein: Thank you.
Jasen Stine: Because you're dead
on right and so we're coming up
on time to get on. Get your
thoughts of one last thing about
and we're already kind of
talking about it probably not
selling things as it relates to
the business, but what about for
the accountants? What advice
would you give people to sell
like, let's say, they've done
the questioning, they've gotten
some information, they have some
thoughts on how they could kind
of get a client into advisory
services? How do you then cross
that, that that chasm,
especially for the first time,
right and sell the service to an
ask for the money? And what
does that look like? Is that a
subscription model or is it a
one time flat fee, or what does
that look like?
Geni Whitehouse: It could be. It
could be whatever model you
want, but the hard part is is
getting that client to
appreciate the value of what
you're going to do. This is the
Ron Baker and Ed class. You know
the value pricing model. How do
I ask a client how much pain
there in? So if I've gone
through that grid, I've gone
through that grid and I've had
you say what works, what's
broken or not working, and then
what you want to achieve.
Ideally, all I have to do now is
go. What would it be worth to
you if you could achieve any one
of these outcomes use
identified, or how much is it
costing you that your
operational systems are broken?
Or how much are you spending on
the 50,000 spreadsheets that
you're doing in your team in
order to come up with a data
point in the moment, right now,
and then when they can start
seeing the value of the pain or
the impact of that pain, it's a
very easy thing to go. You know,
I think I can help you with
this. I can give you a model to
show you that, and then I can
work with your teams. Give them
train and then we can. We can
create a plan to help improve
whatever it is you're struggling
with. But what I normally do is
an initial engagement to review
what's happening, to gather
info for them and summarize it.
So it's basically like a needs
analysis. Let me get with your
team and find out what some of
their challenges are, will
compile that in a half day
meeting and it's going to be a
fixed fee of this and from there
will come out with what we
should work on next and then
we'll price it as we step
through the components. But the
first value I can deliver to you
is clarity from your teams
around what's really happening
at their level. And so it's
really it's a phase thing where
you say these are the kinds of
things we can do, but let's
start with real clarity around
what the organization needs, and
I've got your perspective as
the owner and this aligns with
what everybody else thinks is
going on and what they think
we're trying to achieve and all
these other things, and then
bringing that together is a huge
value for them. Whether they
use me to do the next thing or
not, I have a deliverable that
they appreciate and they always
come out of this video. Is that?
This was fantastic? What can we
do that?
Jasen Stine: They're not.
They're not thinking to do that
at their own accord. Right,
that's, that's what you can
bring to the table. Yeah.
Geni Whitehouse: And then you
can just hold them accountable
to whatever they commit to do.
That comes out of that meeting
and that's a server. You can
show up every month and say,
okay, let's review what you all
have done and then, if they
haven't done anything, then you
go. Well, maybe I need to help
you get this done, let me come
sit with your team or whatever.
So it's a constant sort of a
helping them move forward.
Jasen Stine: And that's where
you could implement a
subscription model, and then you
could package your compliance
services into that as well, and
so it's all just just done, and
then you set it up on automatic
EFTs, right, so you're not
chasing the clients, chasing
invoices. That's right, perfect,
well, great, really great tips.
Jeannie, thanks so much for for
coming on the show Again. What
was that website? Again, if
people want to go check out the
training, the impactful advisor
calm the T H E impactful advisor
. Calm, go check it out folks.
Really awesome training and
tools that change touched on and
hopefully you know some, some
helpful tidbits and some you
know every guest that we have on
the show you know bring some
unique perspective to things and
I think you know some of your
examples, jeannie been
definitely and we just continue
to have these conversations
until it clicks and everybody's
able to do this with with the
ease that we know that they're
capable.
Geni Whitehouse: It's great.
Thank you so much, jason and
David, for having me here. It's
always a pleasure.
Jasen Stine: Absolutely Well.
Thanks, jeannie, and thanks for
listening. Till next time.
Thanks for listening. If you
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produced and edited by Luke
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